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Producer Matsui Wants to Hear What We Want!Follow

#102 Aug 27 2012 at 12:21 PM Rating: Good
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Akihiko Matsui wrote:

Thank you so much for the large amount of comments! We will now be closing the thread.

There are a huge amount of suggestions from Japan, North America, and Europe, but I will be looking over each and every post that followed the instructions, and will be taking it all into consideration as I think about the future of FINAL FANTASY XI and the mutual feelings of the community.

I also have one more request for you all. I hope that you all could read over all of the posts in this thread (of course, reading over what you can is fine, too).

After playing with your friends for so long, you often start to think and play the same way as the them, including your linkshell members, and players that you spend a lot of time with and grow close to.

In this thread there are posts from these people as well as people who think in a completely different way. I’d like you to try and understand what adventurers other than yourself are thinking and looking for.

In order to continue to protect the FINAL FANTASY XI that we all love, we need everyone's cooperation or we'll be unable to accomplish anything.

I'd like to place more importance on the community and work side-by-side with you all.
From here on out I would appreciate it if you could consider the fact that there are people in the community who think in a variety of different ways and to sometimes write your feedback and opinions from an open-minded standpoint.

Thank you all very much!

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/26797-Let-Producer-Matsui-Know-How-He-Should-Catch-Up-on-2-Years!?p=357023#post357023

Edited, Aug 27th 2012 2:25pm by Szabo
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#103 Aug 27 2012 at 2:30 PM Rating: Good
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I'm really liking this guy....
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#104 Aug 27 2012 at 7:41 PM Rating: Good
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#105 Aug 27 2012 at 7:55 PM Rating: Decent
I am glad I got my comments in, even though I forgot one, before I got locked out of the official forums for not having an account. Good luck man, may you recapture our hearts.
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#106 Aug 27 2012 at 9:49 PM Rating: Default
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Szabo wrote:
Akihiko Matsui wrote:

Thank you so much for the large amount of comments! We will now be closing the thread.

There are a huge amount of suggestions from Japan, North America, and Europe, but I will be looking over each and every post that followed the instructions, and will be taking it all into consideration as I think about the future of FINAL FANTASY XI and the mutual feelings of the community.

I also have one more request for you all. I hope that you all could read over all of the posts in this thread (of course, reading over what you can is fine, too).

After playing with your friends for so long, you often start to think and play the same way as the them, including your linkshell members, and players that you spend a lot of time with and grow close to.

In this thread there are posts from these people as well as people who think in a completely different way. I’d like you to try and understand what adventurers other than yourself are thinking and looking for.
In order to continue to protect the FINAL FANTASY XI that we all love, we need everyone's cooperation or we'll be unable to accomplish anything.

I'd like to place more importance on the community and work side-by-side with you all.
From here on out I would appreciate it if you could consider the fact that there are people in the community who think in a variety of different ways and to sometimes write your feedback and opinions from an open-minded standpoint.

Thank you all very much!

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/26797-Let-Producer-Matsui-Know-How-He-Should-Catch-Up-on-2-Years!?p=357023#post357023

Edited, Aug 27th 2012 2:25pm by Szabo



I feel this guy understands me. And the fact Sch's can become true battle mages. I like our new director.
#107 Aug 28 2012 at 1:53 AM Rating: Excellent
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kimjongil76 wrote:
I feel this guy understands me. And the fact Sch's can become true battle mages. I like our new director.

In Bizarro World, I hear they have melee scholar debates.
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#109 Aug 28 2012 at 7:20 AM Rating: Excellent
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Zeld more or less nailed SCH's "melee existence" if you want to peg it as such. Though, since SE added Shattersoul, Staff isn't such a terrible weapon anymore. But they basically face RDM's problem of no melee traits, even fewer spells to bolster them such, and even lesser gear selection. If I had to correlate now, they're like where 75 RDMs were, albeit with a slight edge due to SS.
#110 Aug 28 2012 at 7:49 AM Rating: Decent
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Akihiko Matsui wrote:

Thank you so much for the large amount of comments! We will now be closing the thread.

There are a huge amount of suggestions from Japan, North America, and Europe, but I will be looking over each and every post that followed the instructions, and will be taking it all into consideration as I think about the future of FINAL FANTASY XI and the mutual feelings of the community.

I also have one more request for you all. I hope that you all could read over all of the posts in this thread (of course, reading over what you can is fine, too).

After playing with your friends for so long, you often start to think and play the same way as the them, including your linkshell members, and players that you spend a lot of time with and grow close to.

In this thread there are posts from these people as well as people who think in a completely different way. I’d like you to try and understand what adventurers other than yourself are thinking and looking for.

In order to continue to protect the FINAL FANTASY XI that we all love, we need everyone's cooperation or we'll be unable to accomplish anything.

I'd like to place more importance on the community and work side-by-side with you all.
From here on out I would appreciate it if you could consider the fact that there are people in the community who think in a variety of different ways and to sometimes write your feedback and opinions from an open-minded standpoint.

Thank you all very much!


I understand what players who have different opinions than me are thinking because I ask them.

As a customer who has been paying you money for 9 years every month, for at least one account, I expect you to be able to vet the poorly thought out and held opinions. I would prefer you poll the servers to determine what we want rather than assuming there is a huge difference in the way your customers think because of a few apples in the basket that taste different.
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#111 Aug 28 2012 at 8:19 AM Rating: Decent
Seriha wrote:
Zeld more or less nailed SCH's "melee existence" if you want to peg it as such. Though, since SE added Shattersoul, Staff isn't such a terrible weapon anymore. But they basically face RDM's problem of no melee traits, even fewer spells to bolster them such, and even lesser gear selection. If I had to correlate now, they're like where 75 RDMs were, albeit with a slight edge due to SS.

SS! You had me confused for a second there! Shatter Soul really bridges a gap, I can lay down roughly 800 damage to Mid level Voidwatch nms Tp gain where sch has their issue. And it takes a lot of effort to even compete with competently(By that I mean a reasonably equipped DD via AH and some end game gear) equipped DDs let alone even coming close to high end one in sheer ws damage. Sch will never be able to keep up with even a summoner in terms of Melee dps. Hell they have a hard time even keeping up with BLM in terms of sheer ws damage with SS haha. Better INT gear, same selection of weapons.

So yeah, fun to play around with definitely never, ever, gonna be able to even pass whm and rdm in that race. I could just run with my red arts idea again, that was a fun thought hahaha.
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#112 Aug 28 2012 at 9:32 AM Rating: Good
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When I saw that I thought, "This producer is trying to get off on the right foot with us."

And indeed, it seems he has. Seems more open than Tanaka. ^^
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#113 Aug 29 2012 at 8:20 AM Rating: Decent
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You know after reading all the posts from the lodestone.....

I am so glad for my work I never allow students to say "What they want" from the IT System. The maturity level of some are appauling at best.. very sorry if this sounds insulting but people dont even try to be diplomatic... "It Sucks" to me is not an answer to the OPs question.. :)

As for the others who actually spent the time on actual answers, some of them are actually pretty good
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#114 Aug 29 2012 at 1:03 PM Rating: Decent
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Lonix wrote:
You know after reading all the posts from the lodestone.....

I am so glad for my work I never allow students to say "What they want" from the IT System. The maturity level of some are appauling at best.. very sorry if this sounds insulting but people dont even try to be diplomatic... "It Sucks" to me is not an answer to the OPs question.. :)

As for the others who actually spent the time on actual answers, some of them are actually pretty good



Your analogy is off.

Someone pays the salary of IT staff much like someone pays the salary of video game designers at SE. In the latter case, that's us. As stakeholders in this quid pro quo that SE is getting for our subscription fees, they are supposed to offer things we want. "It sucks" is certainly an answer to not getting what we want. Their job, their expertise in fact, is to design new offerings that we, the stakeholders, continue to want.

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#115 Aug 29 2012 at 2:00 PM Rating: Decent
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TheBarrister wrote:

Your analogy is off.

Someone pays the salary of IT staff much like someone pays the salary of video game designers at SE. In the latter case, that's us. As stakeholders in this quid pro quo that SE is getting for our subscription fees, they are supposed to offer things we want. "It sucks" is certainly an answer to not getting what we want. Their job, their expertise in fact, is to design new offerings that we, the stakeholders, continue to want.



It doesn't matter how you want to classify the relationship between SE and the players of FFXI.

Its not an excuse for rudeness, immaturity and disrespect. These attributes of character transcend relationships.
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#116 Aug 29 2012 at 2:58 PM Rating: Good
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Xilk wrote:
TheBarrister wrote:

Your analogy is off.

Someone pays the salary of IT staff much like someone pays the salary of video game designers at SE. In the latter case, that's us. As stakeholders in this quid pro quo that SE is getting for our subscription fees, they are supposed to offer things we want. "It sucks" is certainly an answer to not getting what we want. Their job, their expertise in fact, is to design new offerings that we, the stakeholders, continue to want.



It doesn't matter how you want to classify the relationship between SE and the players of FFXI.

Its not an excuse for rudeness, immaturity and disrespect. These attributes of character transcend relationships.

I could give a flying f**k about maturity or respect toward them. You get into an MMO, you should have been ready to interact with the players from the launch, and you should should expect simple answers from a portion of simple or emotionally un-developed subscribers.



The only reason I don't particularly prefer "it sucks" as a response is specificity: it's one thing to know you done messed up, it's a whole other to learn you messed up and get handed the enlightenment to do better.

Of course, S-E has a habit of ignoring constructive feedback even when it's being properly articulated; the new 2-hour thread sports full of responses from the reps defending or excusing the 2h design choices that no one likes. The players don't care about that, no one is interested in excuses why they won't change 2-hours everyone hates--all the devs should be saying is "right, we hear you, thanks for the ideas, we're headed back to the drawing board."

The upside (if you could call it that) of properly articulating discontent is reserving the right to properly lambaste S-E when they finally ignore input that may well be unanimous.

Edited, Aug 29th 2012 2:06pm by SunriderRagnarok
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#117 Aug 29 2012 at 3:25 PM Rating: Default
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Entitled gamers- the way of the future!
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#118 Aug 29 2012 at 3:38 PM Rating: Excellent
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xypin wrote:
Entitled gamers- the way of the future!


Well, we pay for the service don't we? It isn't like SE is running a charity here.
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#119 Aug 29 2012 at 3:54 PM Rating: Excellent
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I have for many years wanted a way log into the game faster. I get so tired of having to click so many things and confirm each step of the login process.

It really becomes irritating, if for some reason, you lose connection and get booted, then it seems to take forever to go back through all those menus to get back in and try to rejoin a group you were with or whatever.

If there is a possible way to make the login process a one or two step process, that would be awesome.

Edited, Aug 29th 2012 5:57pm by dandantlm
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#120 Aug 29 2012 at 4:00 PM Rating: Good
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Xilk wrote:
TheBarrister wrote:

Your analogy is off.

Someone pays the salary of IT staff much like someone pays the salary of video game designers at SE. In the latter case, that's us. As stakeholders in this quid pro quo that SE is getting for our subscription fees, they are supposed to offer things we want. "It sucks" is certainly an answer to not getting what we want. Their job, their expertise in fact, is to design new offerings that we, the stakeholders, continue to want.



It doesn't matter how you want to classify the relationship between SE and the players of FFXI.

Its not an excuse for rudeness, immaturity and disrespect. These attributes of character transcend relationships.


Rudeness also encompasses years of neglecting feedback that was solicited and unsolicited.

Please don't forget that.
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#121 Aug 29 2012 at 4:01 PM Rating: Good
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xypin wrote:
Entitled gamers- the way of the future!


Blind fanaticism - the way of the past.
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#122 Aug 29 2012 at 4:06 PM Rating: Default
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Because it's clearly impossible to not be rude and not have blind fanaticism.
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#123 Aug 29 2012 at 4:16 PM Rating: Decent
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xypin wrote:
Because it's clearly impossible to not be rude and not have blind fanaticism.


Actually yes - they go quite nicely, hand in hand with each other.


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#124Prrsha, Posted: Aug 29 2012 at 6:08 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) [prediction]Here we go...
#125 Aug 29 2012 at 7:19 PM Rating: Decent
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Quirk's Exception.

Edited, Aug 29th 2012 6:23pm by Raelix
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#126 Aug 29 2012 at 7:40 PM Rating: Default
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Raelix wrote:
Quirk's Exception.

Edited, Aug 29th 2012 6:23pm by Raelix


There is an exception for every exception: Godwin's Law (Redirected from Quirk's Exception) en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quirk%27s_Exception

Now, lets put a figure on infinity or an irrational number.

A joke is just that.

Edited, Aug 29th 2012 9:43pm by Prrsha
#127jtftaru, Posted: Aug 30 2012 at 3:03 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) I don't understand how Godwin got a law named after him. Mentioning Nazis is nothing to do with the Internet.
#128 Aug 30 2012 at 7:18 AM Rating: Excellent
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The more I think of it, the more I wonder if he should even have created that thread. It almost seems like a way to limit himself solely to the ideas that were posted there. I hope he'll always be reading our complaints and suggestions. The entire official forums should be his complaints and suggestions thread. He should have someone checking ZAM, etc. for him as well.

And, he shouldn't ignore a comment simply because the poster was angry or rude. Though there's little excuse for rudeness, anger can certainly be justified. I think much of the community's anger is.

Maybe he's already thinking this way and my concerns are meaningless, but I'm afraid to assume just from one thread that this guy is the answer to all our prayers. I mean he's already a notch above Tanaka, but that's not saying much and that's not going to be enough. We'll just have to see, but I'm keeping my Shades of Skepticism on for now. SE and Matsui still have much to prove.

xypin wrote:
Entitled gamers- the way of the future!


Yeah, because asking for what you want is the same as feeling entitled. To be honest, I think game developers these days are the ones feeling entitled, but that's a whole 'nother thread.

Edited, Aug 30th 2012 10:44am by Camiie
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#129 Aug 30 2012 at 10:03 AM Rating: Decent
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Camiie wrote:
xypin wrote:
Entitled gamers- the way of the future!
Yeah, because asking for what you want is the same as feeling entitled. To be honest, I think game developers these days are the ones feeling entitled, but that's a whole 'nother thread.
I have no problem with making suggestions or pointing out faults of a game and asking for fixes. It's this idea that someone EXPECTS and DEMANDS equal treatment despite writing a very rude, immature, and insulting post that I find to be insane.

Should SE consider all posts equally? Probably.
Will they? Probably not, computers and zombies are not the ones that are reading the posts and making decisions.
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#130 Aug 30 2012 at 12:21 PM Rating: Default
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scchan wrote:
I think even important for game designer to listen what fans may want, it is more important that they have vision what they want then being customer Yes-man. That is one of "secrets" of Steve Jobs: "Customers don't know what they want before you show it to them".
What I often see is too many Part II, III, or listening to advice that may look appeasing in the short term, but it won't work in the long term.

Well, I will say it is important to pretend to be democratic for marketing reasons, but you got to be ruthlessly eccentric innovator if you want to move forward O_O!



this this this. player polls are dangerous. we've got some dumb people playing this game. I can only hope a little bit of Tanaka's "@#%^ you im right" rubbed off on Matsui. Just a little.


Most players dont really know what they want from a game. but all of us at least think we do.

Edited, Aug 30th 2012 2:23pm by Llester
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#131 Aug 30 2012 at 11:44 PM Rating: Good
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Llester wrote:
scchan wrote:
I think even important for game designer to listen what fans may want, it is more important that they have vision what they want then being customer Yes-man. That is one of "secrets" of Steve Jobs: "Customers don't know what they want before you show it to them".
What I often see is too many Part II, III, or listening to advice that may look appeasing in the short term, but it won't work in the long term.

Well, I will say it is important to pretend to be democratic for marketing reasons, but you got to be ruthlessly eccentric innovator if you want to move forward O_O!



this this this. player polls are dangerous. we've got some dumb people playing this game. I can only hope a little bit of Tanaka's "@#%^ you im right" rubbed off on Matsui. Just a little.


Most players dont really know what they want from a game. but all of us at least think we do.

Edited, Aug 30th 2012 2:23pm by Llester


Oh, they probably know what they want. They just inadvertently disguise it as something else.
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#132 Aug 31 2012 at 4:26 AM Rating: Excellent
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Llester wrote:
this this this. player polls are dangerous.


Mindlessly carrying out one's "vision" is even more so.

Quote:
we've got some dumb people playing this game.


We've got some dumb people on the dev team too.

Quote:
I can only hope a little bit of Tanaka's "@#%^ you im right" rubbed off on Matsui. Just a little.


"F*** you, I'm right" only works when you actually are right. Tanaka took that attitude even when he was dead wrong... no, especially when he was dead wrong. He often put his vision before all reason and logic.

Quote:
Most players dont really know what they want from a game. but all of us at least think we do.


Ah, the Steve Jobs attitude. That will take you a ways if you have some good ideas that some people can get behind, but it won't corner the market. Apple doesn't have nearly as much of the market as it seems they do (not even 20%. Successful, but not nearly the best), and FFXI isn't even close to being the killer app of MMOs.

Edited, Aug 31st 2012 6:27am by Camiie
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#133 Sep 05 2012 at 8:17 PM Rating: Good
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#134 Sep 06 2012 at 3:16 PM Rating: Default
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Hmm I am kind of afraid. SE has never ever come out and said they are relying greatly on the community. I don't know whats going on here, but I suspect 2 major console flops (13/13-2) (arguably 3 FF14) and a PC (FF14) flop all 3 (4) and a potential fifth (FF13-3) has something to do with it.

But it really is me feel wierded out.

and I kind of like it, in that reach around sort of way.
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