Forum Settings
       
1 2 Next »
Reply To Thread

Interview With Mizuki Ito on FFXI's New Expansion PackFollow

#28 Aug 03 2012 at 7:09 PM Rating: Excellent
****
5,745 posts
CelestianNinja wrote:
Cadant wrote:
Am I the only one who sees no point in them adding another tanking job when the current ones are useless at it?

How realistic is it that SE will rework the way enmity works so tanks can actually tank?

Im not sure tanking really changed much, what i believe changed is how people played dd jobs. Back in the days tanking was a group effort. When i tanked years ago i always layed rules down in pt such as no ws before the 2nd voke. It certainly helped keep the flow of exp up

Unfortunately, that flow of exp you refer to was probably 6k/hour. By contrast, a good merit party in the post-dedicated-tank era would kill the mob by the time the voke timer was up.
#29 Aug 03 2012 at 9:23 PM Rating: Decent
Lady Jinte wrote:
Cadant wrote:
CelestianNinja wrote:
Cadant wrote:
Am I the only one who sees no point in them adding another tanking job when the current ones are useless at it?

How realistic is it that SE will rework the way enmity works so tanks can actually tank?

Im not sure tanking really changed much, what i believe changed is how people played dd jobs. Back in the days tanking was a gro
up effort. When i tanked years ago i always layed rules down in pt such as no ws before the 2nd voke. It certainly helped keep the
flow of exp up


Whoever hits the mob the fastest to recap their enmity is the tank now though. Everyone is sitting with capped enmity it makes it impossible for someone to gain more to take hate back

Honestly, it's a combination of both points. Yes, DD style has change significantly, to the point that melees don't hold back at all now, and don't learn when they should know to hold back. However, the other major issue is that enmity generation has not scaled well post 75. DDs are capable of dealing more and more damage, and that leads to more and more hate, and while the damage -> enmity ratio has decreased as the average level of target increased (target level determines how much enmity your hits generate), it's a matter of decreasing returns, in that the higher the monster's level, the less the decrease in enmity from the previous level. At 75, we were converting damage to enmity at a rate of 1:1.25~1.45ish, depending on the target (that covers a range of levels 80~95), the decrease for monsters at level 99 is significantly smaller (I don't have any concrete charts, but based on kanikan's tables, it's fairly easy to figure it to around 1:1.1~1.2ish). On top of that, enmity loss (ie: how much enmity you lose when you get hit) doesn't scale with level, but with max HP, and while the average HP has increased somewhat, it hasn't changed significantly. Additionally, it has a similar relation of diminishing returns. Basically, tanks are still losing enmity at the same rate as they did at 75, but the increase in melee damage has totally outstripped the decrease in enmity generated based on level, so DDs are simply generating significantly more enmity now, to the point that it's incredibly easy for them to cap hate.
I agree 100%
#30 Aug 03 2012 at 9:25 PM Rating: Decent
svlyons wrote:
CelestianNinja wrote:
Cadant wrote:
Am I the only one who sees no point in them adding another tanking job when the current ones are useless at it?

How realistic is it that SE will rework the way enmity works so tanks can actually tank?

Im not sure tanking really changed much, what i believe changed is how people played dd jobs. Back in the days tanking was a group effort. When i tanked years ago i always layed rules down in pt such as no ws before the 2nd voke. It certainly helped keep the flow of exp up

Unfortunately, that flow of exp you refer to was probably 6k/hour. By contrast, a good merit party in the post-dedicated-tank era would kill the mob by the time the voke timer was up.

Yesterdays exp parties per mob as far as time to kill prob about the same as todays NMs... Round about
#31 Aug 03 2012 at 10:54 PM Rating: Good
is Happy on Friday!
Avatar
*****
12,448 posts
Zelduh wrote:
I end up tanking 99% of the time I'm in a group event on PUP. Even in Voidwatch.

Sure you do, champ. You start backing up your comments with proof and we'll start taking them seriously.
____________________________
Theytak, Siren Server, FFXI [Retired]
Amerida Baker, Balmung Server, FFXIV
LOLGAXE IS MY ETERNAL RIVAL!

Reiterpallasch wrote:
Glitterhands wrote:
Am I the only one who clicked on this thread expecting actual baby photos [of Jinte]? o.O

Except if it were baby photos, it would be like looking at before and afters of Michael Jackson. Only instead of turning into a white guy, he changes into a chick!
#33 Aug 04 2012 at 1:49 AM Rating: Excellent
Zelduh wrote:
Proof: the fact that it happens. Do I need to screenshot it or something?


I think she's meaning along the lines of something tangible that we can see. Simply saying that you tank 99% of the time against high-end monsters and not actually having any way of showing that kind makes it hard for people to accept, especially given that "tanking" in those situations is who swings the fastest after they reach the hate cap so that the mob is constantly turning back towards you.

If anyone were to successfully be able to tank a high-end Voidwatch mob for 99% of the fight, I'd sooner chalk it up to everyone else in the alliance being subpar, because even an average melee should be able to reach the hate cap and have a high enough attack rate to tank it for a portion of the time.

Edited, Aug 4th 2012 3:54am by Vlorsutes
____________________________
Lady Jinte wrote:

Vlorsutes' Negotiation Skill rises 0.2 points
Vlorsutes' Observant Parent Skill rises 0.3 points
Vlorsutes' Argument Diffusing Skill rises 0.1 points

#34 Aug 04 2012 at 10:11 PM Rating: Good
***
1,726 posts
Quote:
Quote:
Mizuki wrote:
Although we do not intend to add any new types of weapons, we will add “Bell” instruments for Geomancers.


Smiley: dubious


I think the developer meant they are adding no new weapon types, instead putting new weapons under the umbrella of another weapon by name. In this case, they seem to mean Bell will not be a new weapon type, instead being classified as an Instrument.
#35 Aug 05 2012 at 12:43 AM Rating: Excellent
Quote:
Although we do not intend to add any new types of weapons, we will add “Bell” instruments for Geomancers.


This answer takes on added meaning if you were unfortunate enough to play through some of the early seasonal events of FFXIV.

Please, no bells in FFXI!!!
____________________________
Thayos Redblade
Jormungandr
Hyperion
1 2 Next »
Reply To Thread

Colors Smileys Quote OriginalQuote Checked Help

 

Recent Visitors: 297 All times are in CST
Anonymous Guests (297)