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Nyzul Uncharted: nice gear, cheater!Follow

#452 Jul 23 2012 at 10:52 AM Rating: Good
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Look. It's just a difficult event deliberately made to be a time sink with some really nice rewards for the extremely patient, the extremely lucky and the extremely daring.

I've done this event with a party full of 'cheaters' (clipper/movement speed/fill_mode) (I LOVE pick ups) and we still lost just because of too many bad jumps (we hit the mid 80s after 22 jumps) and I've done this all vanilla and won (one free floor made a huge difference). It really is pure luck with this hot mess.

I almost always keep a note of which floors we've jumped to, and on every win, floor 100 is either jump number 20 or jump number 21 (or less, one time it was on jump 18, bloody incredible). Any more is always a guaranteed loss.

I'm always a scholar because my enhancing is over 500 for super duper embrava. Anyways, anyone on Lak still doing these, hit me up. I need two last pieces.
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#453 Jul 23 2012 at 11:11 AM Rating: Good
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Artemas wrote:
Look. It's just a difficult event deliberately made to be a time sink with some really nice rewards for the extremely patient, the extremely lucky and the extremely daring.

I've done this event with a party full of 'cheaters' (clipper/movement speed/fill_mode) (I LOVE pick ups) and we still lost just because of too many bad jumps (we hit the mid 80s after 22 jumps) and I've done this all vanilla and won (one free floor made a huge difference). It really is pure luck with this hot mess.

I almost always keep a note of which floors we've jumped to, and on every win, floor 100 is either jump number 20 or jump number 21 (or less, one time it was on jump 18, bloody incredible). Any more is always a guaranteed loss.

I'm always a scholar because my enhancing is over 500 for super duper embrava. Anyways, anyone on Lak still doing these, hit me up. I need two last pieces.

Funny, out of the 4 floor 100 clears I've gotten, 3 were jump number 12-13. One was jump number 15. We almost always get 17-18 jumps nowadays and end up in the mid 80s-mid 90s most of the time. Excluding the "Nyzul ******** you over repeatedly" runs, like 3x no ws (chariots family, chariot boss, chariots family) and 1x no white magic (kill all, just as we needed to use embrava again) in one run.
#454 Jul 23 2012 at 11:21 AM Rating: Good
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Sharain wrote:

Funny, out of the 4 floor 100 clears I've gotten, 3 were jump number 12-13. One was jump number 15. We almost always get 17-18 jumps nowadays and end up in the mid 80s-mid 90s most of the time. Excluding the "Nyzul ******** you over repeatedly" runs, like 3x no ws (chariots family, chariot boss, chariots family) and 1x no white magic (kill all, just as we needed to use embrava again) in one run.


That's amazing. Extremely lucky. That 18 was the lowest I've ever seen personally out of all of my attempts. The vast majority of the my runs end around the mid 90s on jump 22 to 24.
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#455 Jul 23 2012 at 11:23 AM Rating: Decent
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Artemas wrote:
Sharain wrote:
Funny, out of the 4 floor 100 clears I've gotten, 3 were jump number 12-13. One was jump number 15. We almost always get 17-18 jumps nowadays and end up in the mid 80s-mid 90s most of the time. Excluding the "Nyzul ******** you over repeatedly" runs, like 3x no ws (chariots family, chariot boss, chariots family) and 1x no white magic (kill all, just as we needed to use embrava again) in one run.
That's amazing. Extremely lucky.
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#456 Jul 23 2012 at 11:41 AM Rating: Decent
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Artemas wrote:
Sharain wrote:

Funny, out of the 4 floor 100 clears I've gotten, 3 were jump number 12-13. One was jump number 15. We almost always get 17-18 jumps nowadays and end up in the mid 80s-mid 90s most of the time. Excluding the "Nyzul ******** you over repeatedly" runs, like 3x no ws (chariots family, chariot boss, chariots family) and 1x no white magic (kill all, just as we needed to use embrava again) in one run.


That's amazing. Extremely lucky. That 18 was the lowest I've ever seen personally out of all of my attempts. The vast majority of the my runs end around the mid 90s on jump 22 to 24.

Yeah, I know it's extremely lucky. But geez, 22-24 jumps? I have no idea how my static could get even close to that many. Can't break 18 unless we get free floors and 17 is much more common than 18 to begin with. :/ Guess I just have to hope for more extreme luck. ^_^ Just thought I'd throw that out there, I found it funny that every time we did hit 100, it was with so much less than what we usually clear.
#457 Jul 23 2012 at 12:31 PM Rating: Good
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It should only take about 20 jumps on average since ??? takes you up anywhere from 2-9. That said, you can get really lucky and reach 100 in 12 jumps, or it can totally ***** you and take as many as 50.
#458 Jul 23 2012 at 12:33 PM Rating: Decent
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Sharain wrote:

Funny, out of the 4 floor 100 clears I've gotten, 3 were jump number 12-13. One was jump number 15. We almost always get 17-18 jumps nowadays and end up in the mid 80s-mid 90s most of the time. Excluding the "Nyzul ******** you over repeatedly" runs, like 3x no ws (chariots family, chariot boss, chariots family) and 1x no white magic (kill all, just as we needed to use embrava again) in one run.

[/quote]

I've seen 22 runs max, and we reached floor 98 with 30 seconds to spare. Most of our runs are in the 17 sweet spot.

Last week we had 2 very weird runs:

1) Got to floor 59 with first embrava wearing. Jumped. Landed on 60 with White Magic restricted. Although we knew the run was over, we tried. Got eventually owned even with perfect use of temps, etc.

2) Got to Floor 49 with 13 jumps in 14.5 minutes. Next 4 jumps were only 13 total floors and they also took 14.5 minutes...


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#459 Jul 23 2012 at 12:40 PM Rating: Excellent
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One thing I don't understand is why does lobby time count against us in NNI? Should just give a 5 minute time limit for the lobby, then 30 mins once you start on floor 1.
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#460 Jul 23 2012 at 4:13 PM Rating: Decent
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At first I thought i would try to understand where the disagreement was coming from, but the close-minded frothing at the mouth is not worthy of any respect.

<Some nonsense about the EULA deleted for brevity.>


It's not hard to understand if you, for half an instant, drop the mindset of a dishonest cheater. Imagine you didn't think it was normal to lie and cheat your way to success, and now imagine how you'd feel when other people did these things without shame or remorse.

This has nothing to do with the EULA. The EULA is a legalese document designed to cover SE's *** if you do something stupid, and to allow them to ban you for any reason they see fit without legal repercussions. No one on this forum has even read the EULA. No one cares what it says. SE doesn't even care what it says since they can change it at a moments notice. It's a legal disclaimer, not the constitution of FFXI. I really shouldn't have to explain this to you; you're grasping at straws.

Quote:
*I* don't cheat Nyzul, I'm just the rune SCH. If the other people in the group insist on using cheats, I just don't care anymore. I've teamed up with people who have ran cheats in the background probably *countless* other times in the past, probably mostly without even realizing it, so why should I let it bother me anymore, really? I choose to not use all that fleehack/clipper nonsense and that's all I really have control of.


What? No, I didn't commit tax fraud. I mean, I let my accountant fudge the numbers so that we could split a fat return, but I wasn't guilty at all! Why are you still arresting me? I didn't commit tax fraud, someone else did it for me! It doesn't count! Stop! STOOOOP!

Good luck with that defense if they decide to actually start banning people.

As for the rest, I'll not waste my time any further because convincing a career cheater to stop cheating is about like telling a career car thief that stealing is bad: The only result will be kneejerk anger that someone dare question their illegitimate gains.

I guess it's true what they say, that everyone's integrity has a price... I'm disappointed but not surprised that for most of you, that price is a piece of video game armor.
#461 Jul 23 2012 at 5:09 PM Rating: Good
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So all the "cheaters" clearly think ItsAMyri is ******* crazy. What about everyone else? Do you all agree simply using windower gives a person a black heart, banishes their soul to ****, and destroys all morality that person would have had?
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#462 Jul 23 2012 at 5:27 PM Rating: Good
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xypin wrote:
So all the "cheaters" clearly think ItsAMyri is batsh*t crazy. What about everyone else? Do you all agree simply using windower gives a person a black heart, banishes their soul to ****, and destroys all morality that person would have had?


I think that if you feel that you need to cheat to get the shiniest new pixels, you need to relax. It is only a game, don't be over concerned about dps.

I also think that if you get upset by someone else using 3rd pty apps to get those shiny new pixels, you also need to relax. It is only a game, don't be over concerned about someone else's shiny pixels. Have fun.
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#463 Jul 23 2012 at 6:24 PM Rating: Excellent
xypin wrote:
So all the "cheaters" clearly think ItsAMyri is batsh*t crazy. What about everyone else? Do you all agree simply using windower gives a person a black heart, banishes their soul to ****, and destroys all morality that person would have had?


Since i was asked

I personally don't care that much. I don't cheat, going so far as to have distanced myself from NNI a little after it was added after getting a feel for which way the wind was blowing; but hey if someone wants to cheat, i say go for it. Not gonna harp on about how its this and its that, the ppl cheating know all that already.

Windower, like life is a miraculous shade of grey imo. I remember some years back ppl said if SE would just allow a windowed mode, they would drop the 3rd pt version in a sec. We see how that's turned out. But again, i don't care that much. I don't use it and that's all i can do.

I'm too old now to play class monitor. I've had to deal with too much....life to give much more that half a **** if the man next to me is on his way to ****. More power to you buddy. But on the same token, if the ban-hammer once more starts its inexorable downward stroke toward some ppl, i hope this time 'round they just take the hit minus all the bawling that was done last time.

And shoot, who knows, maybe nothing major will come of any of this. And that scenario just brings this image to mind


Screenshot



If he can pull off his scam, maybe the some of you fellows can too.
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#464 Jul 24 2012 at 12:39 AM Rating: Default
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TheBarrister wrote:
Rant, cry, whine


In the end those who cheated will be held accountable for their actions. It's is simple as that. (Of course what SE does is yet to be seen, but if history repeats itself... and it normally does... I see salvage style bannings). It doesn't matter what the heck you think because you aren't a GM or an employee of SE. SE has spoken and they have said messing with the lamps is cheating. They encourage people to report those offenders to the STF. It's clear what side SE is on with this argument. You better get with the program... because your cries and excuses will not save you from the ban hammer.

Encouraging people that it is ok to cheat, does a disservice to the community and you just lull gullible people to get banned from the game. Shame on you. Assume the party submission position.

Edited, Jul 24th 2012 2:43am by Prrsha
#465 Jul 24 2012 at 3:59 AM Rating: Excellent
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In the end those who cheated will be held accountable for their actions


That would certainly explain why I still see some people in this game who've cheated for years (like, "since before the Salvage bans" years) and probably still are doing so
#466 Jul 24 2012 at 6:43 AM Rating: Excellent
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xypin wrote:
So all the "cheaters" clearly think ItsAMyri is batsh*t crazy. What about everyone else? Do you all agree simply using windower gives a person a black heart, banishes their soul to ****, and destroys all morality that person would have had?

I don't particularly care one way or the other, I suppose.

I was going to do NNI, but ultimately decided not to due to the playstyle currently, but I don't really care whether people do or not. Everybody saying that its just game is right; it is just a game. So whether you think that means that you shouldn't be so serious and cheat your way through NNI, or whether that means you think that you shouldn't be so serious and not cheat your way through NNI, is ultimately your call. All the message boards and all the rants and all the up/down arrows in the world won't change the way someone plays, so much of this, I feel, is meaningless.

I don't .dat swap. I use windower. Maybe that makes me a hypocrite, but whatever. I don't really feel the need to go desk pounding on forums to change the way the other half plays.

#467 Jul 24 2012 at 9:23 AM Rating: Good
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In the end those who cheated will be held accountable for their actions. It's is simple as that.


SE isn't god. Also, history repeating itself would be nothing happeneing at all ever because SE has a proven track record of being the ********* service provider in the history of service providing, ever.
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#468 Jul 24 2012 at 11:30 AM Rating: Excellent
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TybudX wrote:
Quote:
In the end those who cheated will be held accountable for their actions. It's is simple as that.


SE isn't god. Also, history repeating itself would be nothing happeneing at all ever because SE has a proven track record of being the sh*ttiest service provider in the history of service providing, ever.


Don't let facts get in the way of Prrrshy trying to ignore them.
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#469 Jul 24 2012 at 11:36 AM Rating: Decent
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chalcus wrote:
xypin wrote:
So all the "cheaters" clearly think ItsAMyri is batsh*t crazy. What about everyone else? Do you all agree simply using windower gives a person a black heart, banishes their soul to ****, and destroys all morality that person would have had?
I think that if you feel that you need to cheat to get the shiniest new pixels, you need to relax. It is only a game, don't be over concerned about dps.

I also think that if you get upset by someone else using 3rd pty apps to get those shiny new pixels, you also need to relax. It is only a game, don't be over concerned about someone else's shiny pixels. Have fun.


spiritreaverdiablos the Hand wrote:
xypin wrote:
So all the "cheaters" clearly think ItsAMyri is batsh*t crazy. What about everyone else? Do you all agree simply using windower gives a person a black heart, banishes their soul to ****, and destroys all morality that person would have had?
Since i was asked

I personally don't care that much. I don't cheat, going so far as to have distanced myself from NNI a little after it was added after getting a feel for which way the wind was blowing; but hey if someone wants to cheat, i say go for it. Not gonna harp on about how its this and its that, the ppl cheating know all that already.

Windower, like life is a miraculous shade of grey imo. I remember some years back ppl said if SE would just allow a windowed mode, they would drop the 3rd pt version in a sec. We see how that's turned out. But again, i don't care that much. I don't use it and that's all i can do.

I'm too old now to play class monitor. I've had to deal with too much....life to give much more that half a sh*t if the man next to me is on his way to ****. More power to you buddy. But on the same token, if the ban-hammer once more starts its inexorable downward stroke toward some ppl, i hope this time 'round they just take the hit minus all the bawling that was done last time.

And shoot, who knows, maybe nothing major will come of any of this. And that scenario just brings this image to mind


Screenshot



If he can pull off his scam, maybe the some of you fellows can too.


Altair wrote:
xypin wrote:
So all the "cheaters" clearly think ItsAMyri is batsh*t crazy. What about everyone else? Do you all agree simply using windower gives a person a black heart, banishes their soul to ****, and destroys all morality that person would have had?
I don't particularly care one way or the other, I suppose.

I was going to do NNI, but ultimately decided not to due to the playstyle currently, but I don't really care whether people do or not. Everybody saying that its just game is right; it is just a game. So whether you think that means that you shouldn't be so serious and cheat your way through NNI, or whether that means you think that you shouldn't be so serious and not cheat your way through NNI, is ultimately your call. All the message boards and all the rants and all the up/down arrows in the world won't change the way someone plays, so much of this, I feel, is meaningless.

I don't .dat swap. I use windower. Maybe that makes me a hypocrite, but whatever. I don't really feel the need to go desk pounding on forums to change the way the other half plays.
Glad to hear some different opinions from other readers Smiley: grin
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#470 Jul 24 2012 at 11:45 AM Rating: Decent
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Everybody here falls into two categories: people who don't give a sh*t, and people who give too much sh*t about what other people are doing. For some odd reason this is all I can picture when reading threads like these: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z7P43M2ZL28



Edited, Jul 24th 2012 11:47am by TybudX
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BG elitists <3 haste.

Allatards/uber casuals hate elitists.

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kerberoz wrote:
People don't hate emo kids because they're "misunderstood." People hate emo kids because they're useless.


Realix wrote:
PUP is an average to above average DD... when not in a zerg situation... or on particularly hard targets... and when properly configured... on windsday... with a RDM...
#471 Jul 24 2012 at 11:53 AM Rating: Good
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TybudX wrote:
Everybody here falls into two categories: people who don't give a sh*t, and people who give too much sh*t about what other people are doing. For some odd reason this is all I can picture when reading threads like these: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z7P43M2ZL28Edited, Jul 24th 2012 11:47am by TybudX

Everyone here falls into a single category: people who post their opinion.
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#472 Jul 24 2012 at 12:38 PM Rating: Decent
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Too true. Back to following my own advice, have lots of catching up to do.
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BG elitists <3 haste.

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kerberoz wrote:
People don't hate emo kids because they're "misunderstood." People hate emo kids because they're useless.


Realix wrote:
PUP is an average to above average DD... when not in a zerg situation... or on particularly hard targets... and when properly configured... on windsday... with a RDM...
#474 Jul 24 2012 at 4:36 PM Rating: Good
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Zelduh wrote:
It's 2012 and everyone is glorifying cheating and making the honest people feel like they're doing something wrong. No wonder the world is ending.


I don't know anyone who is glorifying cheating. The point has been made perfectly clear that plenty of players are tired of waiting on SE for alot of changes. No one has criticized players for NOT using 3rd party software.

The problem is the desire to condemn other players, the persistence in ignorance, the hypocrisy and teh broad-brushed blanket judgment coming from your allegedly 'honest' people.

I've been perfectly honest in how I play the game. If I were the demon I've been accused of, I wouldn't be arguing and I would not have openly stated my advocacy for 3rd party tools. I would be condemning or discouraging or otherwise manipulating and deceiving players to gain advantage all the while keeping my image 'pure as the driven snow..'

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#475 Jul 24 2012 at 6:35 PM Rating: Default
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Xilk wrote:
No one has criticized players for NOT using 3rd party software.


Someone posted several pages back that this was not the case in game.

Fynlar wrote:
Quote:
In the end those who cheated will be held accountable for their actions


That would certainly explain why I still see some people in this game who've cheated for years (like, "since before the Salvage bans" years) and probably still are doing so


TybudX wrote:
Quote:
In the end those who cheated will be held accountable for their actions. It's is simple as that.


SE isn't god. Also, history repeating itself would be nothing happeneing at all ever because SE has a proven track record of being the sh*ttiest service provider in the history of service providing, ever.


TheBarrister wrote:
TybudX wrote:
Quote:
In the end those who cheated will be held accountable for their actions. It's is simple as that.


SE isn't god. Also, history repeating itself would be nothing happeneing at all ever because SE has a proven track record of being the sh*ttiest service provider in the history of service providing, ever.


Don't let facts get in the way of Prrrshy trying to ignore them.


Tell that to the people who were banned in Salvage, or did that simple fact just fly over everyone's collective heads. If you think SE doesn't ban people, you are just plain deluded. Granted they don't have 100% track record of banning every offender, but no MMO can claim that. The fact that this "Cheat" is soooo easy to detect through their logs means you guys really shot yourself in the foot.

There is no point in debates anymore. SE has made their statement, time to just grab a lawn chair and a bag of popcorn. Just don't come back whining when you are banned, say SE is such a horrible company, and claim you had no idea what you did was wrong in their eyes. Cause and effect, let the games begin.

I have no further comments to share really, because it has been rehashed to death already. Give SE a few months and we'll see what happens. Until then, this thread is a dead horse. I'm done with explanations and comments. I am happy that SE agrees that it is considered cheating. Props to them.

Edited, Jul 24th 2012 8:44pm by Prrsha
#476 Jul 24 2012 at 6:43 PM Rating: Good
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You keep clinging to those Salvage bans, but the scores of claim botters and gil/account sellers/buyers that went unpunished kind of fly in the face of your grand tirade.

They may punish the NNI cheats, I think it's more likely they'll modify the event to make it more difficult and move on. The grand majority of non-fillmode players here (what you like to call the "honest players") aren't concerned with other people's methods; it doesn't hinder us, so we've no reason to bear a grudge.

The real question is, why do you hold a grudge? Why are you so hard-up to see other people fail?

No need to answer publicly, the just reflect on that a bit.

Edited, Jul 24th 2012 5:47pm by SunriderRagnarok
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#480 Jul 24 2012 at 8:19 PM Rating: Default
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TheBarrister wrote:
SunriderRagnarok wrote:
You keep clinging to those Salvage bans, but the scores of claim botters and gil/account sellers/buyers that went unpunished kind of fly in the face of your grand tirade.

They may punish the NNI cheats, I think it's more likely they'll modify the event to make it more difficult and move on. The grand majority of non-fillmode players here (what you like to call the "honest players") aren't concerned with other people's methods; it doesn't hinder us, so we've no reason to bear a grudge.

The real question is, why do you hold a grudge? Why are you so hard-up to see other people fail?

No need to answer publicly, the just reflect on that a bit.

Edited, Jul 24th 2012 5:47pm by SunriderRagnarok


I think Prrrshy's auto-GM dialer for people doing Fell Cleave for gil speak to why she holds a grudge. She simply cares too much about what other people are doing.

In other words, no one instilled the mind yer own business instinct during the formative years in this one.


I don't have an auto-dialer, that is an outright lie. As for a grudge, you don't even know me IRL. Don't pretend to tell me what I feel or think.

But that is your motto huh? When in doubt, mud sling to avoid the topic in general, check. I'll say what I said in the thread that you lost to Jinte... if you want to toss mud at me personally, feel free to do so in PMs. I'll address you there. There is no point doing it here. It just de-rails the topic. I'll no longer reply to your insults in this thread, its pointless.

As for your grave, keep digging it...

I'll wager SE will temp ban NNI cheaters with a 1 week ban (after they remove their shinies). It's how they handled instance cheating before. That is my opinion (prediction). This is the only fact: SE is against people cheating and no one knows what SE will do in wake of this. All anyone can do is just theorize. Wait and see... and grab your popcorn. It will be an interesting ride.
#481 Jul 24 2012 at 8:26 PM Rating: Decent
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SE has made their statement, time to just grab a lawn chair and a bag of popcorn.


It must suck walking around all day with all that hate and anger inside you. The only reason you even get involved in something like this is because you think that high horse you are on means you are morally 'right', but it doesn't change the fact that you are bitter, petty, closed minded, narcissistic, and judgemental. So SE bans some people? They can have their new accounts back to the same quality in a few months, tops. At the end of the day you'll still be a bad person who takes enjoyment in other people's loss.

Edited, Jul 24th 2012 8:27pm by TybudX
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BG elitists <3 haste.

Allatards/uber casuals hate elitists.

Allatards/uber casuals hate haste, as valuing it would acknowledge that elitists are right


kerberoz wrote:
People don't hate emo kids because they're "misunderstood." People hate emo kids because they're useless.


Realix wrote:
PUP is an average to above average DD... when not in a zerg situation... or on particularly hard targets... and when properly configured... on windsday... with a RDM...
#482 Jul 24 2012 at 8:47 PM Rating: Default
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TybudX wrote:
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SE has made their statement, time to just grab a lawn chair and a bag of popcorn.


It must suck walking around all day with all that hate and anger inside you. The only reason you even get involved in something like this is because you think that high horse you are on means you are morally 'right', but it doesn't change the fact that you are bitter, petty, closed minded, narcissistic, and judgemental. So SE bans some people? They can have their new accounts back to the same quality in a few months, tops. At the end of the day you'll still be a bad person who takes enjoyment in other people's loss.


Hate is a strong word. I hate no one in life. I dislike cheating and I feel it cheapens a nice game... and to be honest it causes more of a feeling of sadness to see a group of the player base stoop that low to achieve that. I love FFXI and to see people rip it apart over an optional item of gear, is sort of disheartening. It feels like the heart and honor of FFXI is slowly bleeding out and that makes me sad. I've had a lot of great memories in FFXI and I have fond feelings for the friends I have met in it. If anyone feels HATE over a video game, they need counseling... or at least a break from it. I won't lie however, a small part of me is pleased to see SE's statement and take a stance against cheating. I feel this is a step in the right direction. I also feel NNI needs work too, but cheating is not the answer in my opinion.

I won't miss the people who are banned for cheating because I feel that in a small part, they are holding back the game and tainting its atmosphere. I don't hate the people who cheat. I dislike their actions and do think they should be held accountable for what they did. After giving this long thought, a temporary ban of the offenders (and removal of the equipment that they got through cheating) would be a fair penalty.

This will be my final post in this thread.

Edited, Jul 24th 2012 11:07pm by Prrsha
#483 Jul 24 2012 at 9:13 PM Rating: Excellent
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svlyons wrote:
Everyone here falls into a single category: people who post their opinion.

Au contraire!
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#484 Jul 24 2012 at 9:22 PM Rating: Excellent
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The Salvage bans (and by that I mean the drama surrounding them) were delicious mainly because of the high-horsing about the tripling drops trick in the week before: "Only those who deserved to know knew about it", and so on. And then those people got banned and cried about it. But they were the only ones who deserved to be able to do it, obviously, none of us plebians merited being good enough to get banned. It was mega-srs-bzns at the time.

I think the majority of those who (let's assume) get banned for NNI will probably be more like "wellp, whatever; I knew what I was risking when I Clippered through walls at 200% speed". If the drama is even a tenth as big as that from the Salvage bans was, I will be greatly surprised.

People aren't going to get banned for .DAT mods.
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#486 Jul 24 2012 at 11:36 PM Rating: Decent
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ItsAMyri wrote:

You're perfectly OK with doing the same task, over and over, forever, with no reward in sight and no sense of progress towards that reward... but crushed by the fact that you lost and have to try again?

Personally, I'm more turned off by a voidwatch item with a 0.5% droprate. I feel much more optimistic about earning NNI gear than I do about getting a Kraken club from the BCNM, even though I can win the BCNM 100% of the time.

Well other people said you should be able to figure out the difference but I'm going to explain it to you since you seem dense. VW you can do 100 runs in a single day. NNI you must wait 100 days to do that many runs.

ItsAMyri wrote:
Doing everything right and failing anyway is life. Last night I was fighting an NM and, despite capped accuracy, missed a crucial Sudden Lunge and died. Was that a license to load clipper and set all my cooldowns to 0 to avoid that fluke of a death? It certainly wouldn't hurt anyone.

It's not every day in dynamis that a monk NM is sitting directly on top of a time extension (missed stun during hundred fists; game over in roughly 3 seconds). It's every bit as much a fluke as rolling a 2-floor progression.


For your dynamis example. That mnk NM will always be on top of the timer. Now, if you link/aggro that NM it rolls a 10 sided die, here are the rolls.

1. You die instantly and are kicked out of Dynamis with no option to RR.
2. You lose 50% of your hp/mp and get to fight the NM, if you lose you are kicked out of Dynamis with no option to RR.
3. You lose all your mp and get to fight the NM, if you lose you are kicked out of Dynamis with no option to RR.
4. You lose 75% of your hp and get to fight the NM, if you lose you are kicked out of Dynamis with no option to RR.
5. You are given a 100% slow effect and get to fight the NM, if you lose you are kicked out of Dynamis with no option to RR.
6. You are given a paralysis effect with a 50% proc rate and get to fight the NM, if you lose you are kicked out of Dynamis with no option to RR.
7. The NM has a permanent Hundred Fists effect, if you lose you are kicked out of Dynamis with no option to RR.
8. Your attack and accuracy is lowered by half, if you lose you are kicked out of Dynamis with no option to RR.
9. You get to fight the NM normally, if you lose you are kicked out of Dynamis with no option to RR.
10. The NM loses 5% of his health, if you lose you are kicked out of Dynamis with no option to RR.

Apparently this is fair to you. No, I have never used .dat mods or clipper.

I do use script macros though which are probably a larger advantage then .dat mods so I guess I'm a cheater.

Edited, Jul 25th 2012 2:16am by heldemon
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#487 Jul 25 2012 at 6:17 AM Rating: Good
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Hmm, I think you missed one, if you're trying to make an analogy with NU:

11. There are four doors on the way to the NM. Each door has two handles in front of it. If you turn the right handle, you get to advance to the next gate. If you turn the wrong handle, a hole opens in the floor and you fall, then you die instantly and are kicked out of Dynamis with no option to RR fall into a room with no exit and have to time out or drop your hourglass.

(now I'm having flashbacks to those "delicious cake" puzzles from a few years ago... it is delicious cake and you must wall hack and flee and change the .dats for the handles to eat it)
#488 Jul 25 2012 at 7:33 AM Rating: Good
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Sharain wrote:

Yeah, I know it's extremely lucky. But geez, 22-24 jumps? I have no idea how my static could get even close to that many. Can't break 18 unless we get free floors and 17 is much more common than 18 to begin with. :/ Guess I just have to hope for more extreme luck. ^_^ Just thought I'd throw that out there, I found it funny that every time we did hit 100, it was with so much less than what we usually clear.


My linkshell is generally very good at killing things. It's all the other stuff that messes us up.
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#492 Jul 27 2012 at 12:49 PM Rating: Decent
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Long as you get your shinies it's all good right? Everything's justified.


Wouldn't say it has anything to do the shinies really, more like accepting inevitability (that is, that people will cheat an incredibly luck-based event that they have a more than decent chance of getting away from it scot-free) instead of trying to fight it in vain, so I can actually take part in an event that I played the **** out of the original version of because I happened to really enjoy it and not have to constantly **** heads with the cheaters (who will still be cheating anyway regardless of what I have to do or say about it). But hey, you can call it what you want.

Edited, Jun 21st 2012 10:55am by Fynlar [/quote]

I don't want to sound like a ****, especially since I'm new to FFXI. But i've been a console gamer for a very long time and play online ALOT. Call of Duty. Battlefield, Metal Gear Online. Those are just a few of the games I've played online where someone has "My team cheats, I don't care. It's not as if I'M doing the cheating. I'm just accepting the fact that they do it."

That reasoning, that one right there ^ Is completely inaccurate. If you accept cheating and the people who use it. Then all your doing is giving the OK to other players to use them. You know what comes next right? "Oh he's using cheats, **** it am not wasting time doing **** the hard way. I'll go download it now. brb." <---- That exact line has been influencial in the down fall of so meny games, you'd of thought it would have gotten old by now. Not intending to aggro you, but I needed your quote and you gave permission to use it at the end of that small piece.

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#493 Jul 27 2012 at 6:21 PM Rating: Good
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That reasoning, that one right there ^ Is completely inaccurate. If you accept cheating and the people who use it. Then all your doing is giving the OK to other players to use them.


My "OK" doesn't mean jack. People will cheat regardless of what I think about it. I'm not the one who polices the game. I've TRIED to, but after reporting X many cheaters (that weren't RMT, which tend to just respawn as different names after a certain period of time anyway) and seeing the majority of them still around in the game today, I got tired of trying. Obviously, it's not even a big deal to the people running the game, so why should it be a big deal to me?

Quote:
You know what comes next right? "Oh he's using cheats, @#%^ it am not wasting time doing sh*t the hard way. I'll go download it now. brb."


Whatever you say, buddy.

I think you should probably learn to speak for yourself.
#494 Jul 28 2012 at 6:05 AM Rating: Decent
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Zantenkai wrote:
I don't want to sound like a ****, especially since I'm new to FFXI. But i've been a console gamer for a very long time and play online ALOT. Call of Duty. Battlefield, Metal Gear Online. Those are just a few of the games I've played online where someone has "My team cheats, I don't care. It's not as if I'M doing the cheating. I'm just accepting the fact that they do it."

That reasoning, that one right there ^ Is completely inaccurate. If you accept cheating and the people who use it. Then all your doing is giving the OK to other players to use them. You know what comes next right? "Oh he's using cheats, @#%^ it am not wasting time doing sh*t the hard way. I'll go download it now. brb." <---- That exact line has been influencial in the down fall of so meny games, you'd of thought it would have gotten old by now. Not intending to aggro you, but I needed your quote and you gave permission to use it at the end of that small piece.

Zan
You're comparing apples and oranges.

The scenario you pictured involved players apathetic to other players using cheats that negatively affect yet more players. This can't be compared to Neo-Nyzul since the results of the cheating done by players simply don't negatively affect other players, directly or indirectly. No new equipment is introduced to the market, loot pools for other players are not diminished, Neo-Nyzul doesn't suddenly become more difficult the more people beat it.

Being apathetic to something that harms none whatsoever isn't some slippery slope. A player will either decide to adopt the behavior of the cheaters (still, with no adverse effect to anyone else), or not. As has been repeatedly testified in this thread, there are many who don't give a ****, and continue to participate in Neo-Nyzul conventionally, that is if they participate at all.

Edited, Jul 28th 2012 5:06am by SunriderRagnarok
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#495 Jul 28 2012 at 6:06 AM Rating: Default
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Not a problem "buddy".

I don't cheat in any games fact. I don't condone cheating of any kind or those who support it regardless of wether they are using or allowing others to use. The simple fact is you should make some decent friends on FFXI who you can trust not to cheat and stick with them. Just so you know I am speaking for myself I'm not some jackass who follows the crowd. Can you say the same?
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#496 Jul 28 2012 at 6:16 AM Rating: Decent
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Zantenkai wrote:
The simple fact is you should make some decent friends on FFXI who you can trust not to cheat and stick with them.


I have met decent human beings who cheat. Cheating at FFXI doesn't give you horns and a tail and mean you have to go around stealing candy from babies or plot world domination. I'm friends with good guys who .dat swap (is that what we're talking about when cheating comes up?) and use other questionable programs, that I don't use myself. They're all well adjusted human beings with interesting lives and personalities beyond the fact that they cheat.

I'm not saying I agree with their methods, I'm just taking a little offense to the US OR THEM mentality flying around here, I guess.
#497 Jul 28 2012 at 8:55 AM Rating: Good
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Altair wrote:
Cheating at FFXI doesn't give you horns and a tail and mean you have to go around stealing candy from babies or plot world domination..
You just killed any reason I had for cheating... Smiley: mad
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#498 Jul 28 2012 at 9:26 AM Rating: Excellent
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Zantenkai wrote:
Just so you know I am speaking for myself I'm not some jackass who follows the crowd. Can you say the same?

I'm sure most of the players that you would classify as "cheaters" could honestly say the same thing. Whether you're talking about the use of windower on its own, or light luggage, or spellcast, or apradar/flee hack/clipper/etc, they look at the tool and ask themselves, "Does this enhance my experience, and can I live with the risk it brings?" They don't simply say, "A lot of other people are using it, so I'll use it too."
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#499 Jul 28 2012 at 9:30 AM Rating: Good
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Quote:
The simple fact is you should make some decent friends on FFXI who you can trust not to cheat and stick with them.


DURR HURR HE MUST NOT HAVE ANY FRIENDS IN GAME WHAT A LOSER

Most of my friends, despite being awsum people, are simply not good enough to do HQ Nyzul. I know it, and I'm sure most of them do too. Trying to get them to go would be a waste of their time and mine, and would just be an exercise in futility and demotivation.

The ones that are good enough? Guess what, I've found that they cheat anyway because they're apparently still not satisfied with whatever win rate they got or would get without them.
#500 Jul 28 2012 at 9:42 AM Rating: Decent
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Its never been about win/rate or getting shinies for me. I do WANT the shinies, but thats mostly because its fun to try unique and interesting equipment sets to different situations.

again, broad brushing a group as cheaters for the use of 3rd party applications is misleading. It implies they are impeding or gaining unfair advantage over others. Most 3rd party tools are interface enhancements which make available information more easily and conveniently available.
There is a group of players who are the "win-no-matter-what" way of thinking. However, this does not describe most players who use 3rd party tools in my opinion. Most 3rd party tools address the negligence SE has had toward the user interface for many years. SE has been non-responsive regarding most tools because they do not threaten, but enhance the game. IF SE made stronger moves against 3rd party tools at this point, they would lose alot of money in subscriptions, either by banning or by players quitting. I don't think I would keep playing if the interface tools were disabled.
I think SE should work to incorporate most the features in these tools and thereby make them obsolete. I hear WoW did a good job managing 3rd party tools this way. I think they are slowly working towards this for some tools like showing recast on spells/ja's or maybe showing party/alliance tp. However, I think they won't even scratch some things like the limit of gear swaps in a macro.
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#501 Jul 28 2012 at 10:53 AM Rating: Good
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I think history is a great lesson here. When the masses are not listened to, they do what collectively is felt to be a better path. What makes it easy for me to empathize with what "cheaters" are doing is that unlike citizens rebelling against inept leadership or one of thousands of other historical examples of leadership failure, we are actually paying for this, and we want a system that rewards us in a reasonable manner for the $ and time spent.
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