I support gil buying.Follow

How do you guys know which ones are the gil buyers, if I bought gil I wouldn't go advertise it to the whole wide world. So you look at the player that has better gears than you and then some how "judge" his playing skill and determine whether or not he buys gil?

How are they affecting your game play when the same pair of boot from the same Simurgh spawn will be claimed by another LS or say your self and put into circulation anyway?

You take it for granted that a person who just plunked down 100 dollars for some gil doesn't value it as much as you who farmed goobue for gil, therefore are willing to drive prices up. If I got 10 mil regardless if bought or earned, I will try to make the most of it.

OP said it right, Gill buying isn't affecting some people as much as other. There's plenty of other threads outthere about how the online economy works for you to look up instead of conjuring the big bad anti RMT wolf. Imagine if the gillbuyers starts going around giving people **** for NOT buying gil and spending all that time on a video game, aye there's a sore spot. Yes its illegal, just like how windower are illegal, most of you used it anyway yes? The illegal Card is the last one you should play here.

Morallity and ethics are subjective, Get off your high horse.

Edit: Double Post.

Edited, Sun May 7 23:22:39 2006 by EonsdarkCaitsith

You really can't. It's basically a witch hunt. The ones that do stick out, stick out badly.

The ones that have half a brain can slip under the radar, and usually think up some alibi if someone gets over-zealous.



When gil prices on IGE and other sites dropped dramatically for a Christmas special, there were hordes of people that cashed in. Although this money wasn't 'created', it moved to hands that would readily circulate it into the economy. All of the classical wallet breaking items soared in price (SH, Hauby, Snipers, Okotes, Higher weapons, other stuff). Think if you had received money as a Christmas gift to buy a Haubergeon at the going price beforehand, to literally wake up one morning and find the price millions above normal.

Or we'll just let The wiki-ites battle it out

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cultural_relativism#Cultural_Relativism_and_Moral_Relativism



Yes that's the sore spot in this argument, People all don't aggree that RMT is a bad thing like say, evil or what ever. How about you use something else that resemble our situation a bit more, like eating dogs. Some people find them cute, some find them delicious. Lets compared them to tasty puppies instead. Now from what moral high point are you judging others about RMT or eating dogs? Well I guessed those of us that haven't been affected too much by this whole thing are a little unsympathetic with those that are. I'll give you that much. I would say in the end. RMT = annoying to alot of people, some more so than others. OP made his points, we made ours, nothing really for me to add.


Edited, Sun May 7 23:58:03 2006 by Bowser

Let me put it nice and simply. Gilsellers use exploits and cheats to make their money. They also intentionally hike prices and ruin ways for other people to make money INTENTIONALLY to make it more difficult to make money and thus encourage gil buying.

Gil sellers are parasites and gil buyers are failures in the game. RMT hurts the game for everyone, sure, casual players might not care and might sell their characters. But real gamers play because they enjoy it, not to leech from everyone else for a paycheck.

If I made a business going to sports games and stealing all the equipment to sell back at an inflated price, is that ok because its just a game?

Might be nice if you didn't pull **** out of your *** with no idea about the ideas behind a doctrine, just sayin'.

Subjectivism takes many, many forms, many of which hold personal responsibility to be the absolute pinnicale of life. In Sartreian existential subjectivism for instance, people even choose to be born, and must take accountability for every action that derives from that choice. That would include everything from their socioeconomic position, to the morals that the person develops. That's right kids, the mean ol' subjectivist told you that you chose to be poor! (Though Sartre does make a very compelling argument, that is neither here nor there).

If a kid went on a killing spree, subjective philosophy can't call it evil, but many of them would certainly not blame it on everyone else aside from the kid. A core belief of many subjectivists is that whatever the child does will bear its own reprecussions, and whether or not he is punnished depends not on the good or evil of the action, but on whatever the hell society chooses to do. On a side note, the reprecussions of society are also neither good nor evil; they just are.

If a subjectivist were to walk down the street and witness a mugging, the fact of being a subjectivist has absolutely no bearing on how he will choose to respond. If the subjectivist so wills, then he may very well whip out a knife and gouge the muggers liver out and eat them with some fava beans and a nice chianti. He may simply use equal force to disarm the mugger and save the person in distress, or, as stated, he may simply walk in a different direction.

The point is, subjectivism is not a donctrine about morality in itself, rather, it is a doctrine about reality (or at least what is most probable). The implications from the doctrine allow people to create their own morals from essentially a blank slate, which is where morality comes into play. How people decide to act, however, is not decided by what they think about reality.

F*cken Christ, for the love of god.... THE SOCKS ARE DOING MY HEAD IN! I love the cowardice.

i'm sure that's what you tell your "customers" at the corner. just another means to an end.

how about you post your character name, douchebag?

you say the economy doesnt effect you, yet you say that you party with gimps that are broke, therefore it does effect you.


open your eyes

And what group is that? If you have me pegged so well. I'll bet you 1000 gil you can't guess my political preference.
By the way. I've actually saved 3 lives during the course of my career (going on 5 years now). I've treated several others for injuries. I've put thieves, sexual predators, stalkers, spousal abusers, and child molesters in jail and off the street where they can only harm, and be harmed, by others like them.

Not that I owe you an explanation. But my point is this. If that makes me selfish. What does that make you?
Let's start with this. You understand that the US (and Japan) is a free market economy, right?

Since Graham Bell invented the phone, that means every phone-related product not owned by the Bell Company is using someone else's work to make money. Yes, you're arguement is that flawed.
If it's ruined, there's no point in playing, right? If you don't play MMORPGs anymore, why are you even here?



Possibly. I don't use windower, but my understanding is it does allow you to do certain things, like move faster. If this is the case then it allows you to collect gil/drops faster and potentionally help drive up the economy much in the same manner as gilsellers have. Hell, for all I know, gilsellers could just be riding the money wave generated by those using 3rd party programs.



Oh no you don't! Don't change the rules. I'm talking about the whole kit n' kaboodle. Don't try to throw icing on a **** and call it a cupcake. So let's answer the question "Is windower giving some players an unfair advantage -in- the game?" YES. Next.



No more than any other violation of the ToS. Including gilselling/buying.


No. They are both like violating the TOS. Period.

Wow.

Have you never camped an NM against Gil-Farmers? Do you even play this game?

The existance of RMT is the reason why players have to camp against teams of Gil-farmers that don't sleep and never log off. While Mr. Legit is trying to make an honest dollar to improve his character, he has next to no chance of winning that NM claim because 6 Gil Farmers who are going to use the gil to make real life money are camping it 24/7. That legit player has almost 0 chance of getting that NM claim, and when he does he has to deal with the Gil-Sellers trying to MPK him and doing anything in their power to get him killed. After they've camped the NM 24/7 they eventually monopolize it and are able to completely control the price of the drop. Since they want to make as much money as possible AND have total control over the drops, they will hike the price to ridiculous amounts because players have no choice but to buy from them. Those players spend so much money on over-inflated items, they go broke. What's the solution when you're broke? Well many of them buy gil. Guess what that does? It keeps that Gil-Farming team at that NM and lets them know that they will be able to continue ******** other players for months to come.

You know what Windower does? It lets me check my email, browse the net when I'm on the airship, and talk to people on MSN. It lets me use my computer for other things and generally be a hell of a lot more productive while playing. Now tell me that Windower is just as bad as making hundreds of peoples game experience ****** because they have to deal with Gil-Farmers.

This is exactly, precisely, on the nose, no doubt about it, the number one reason why this game is doomed.

IGE owns it!
There is such a stigma against buying gil, but almost EVERYONE does it, especially at the endgame levels. There's no honest way around it, unless you spend your entire waking life in front of the screen, monotonously killing the same things over and over in an attempt to afford something useful.

It's a reasonable attitude; there are only about six useful items in the entire goddamn game. It's not that 'parties fight things they weren't intended to!'...it's that individual players are hopelessly underpowered, to the point where a raw character at level 75, without stat boosts and gear boosts, is worthless against anything even approaching his own level. Unless you buy one of the six existing items that are decent, you are, as the OP tacitly puts it, worthless.

Why? Oh, it keeps you playing.

Celly, this was a lovely novel about the results of never leaving one's chair. It's ALL brainless work; melee damage dealing isn't the beginning and end. Frustration does not equal mental difficulty; it's tempting to SAY so, especially when you've spent, oh, five years of your life doing nothing else, but nothing good comes of it. It's all brainless work, most especially the earning of hard-won gil in order to keep up with the asshat next door with more money than God, and fewer brains than the average housecat.

The OP is correct. Your merit = your credit card, the sellers control the market. If you think it isn't so, look at the sheer size of the RMT business, and the gear being sported by the average level 75 player, then traipse on over to the AH and check out the associated cost. It's not space engineering here, guys.
It really doesn't matter as to whether the OP buys gil or not: the tradeoff wasn't pretty, either. The gil she didn't buy, she wasted years of her life gaining. Crafting? Tell me about it. I had two characters with four maxed craft skills combined. Absolutely ridiculous amount of time spent, and I'd give an awful lot to have all that wasted time back, to spend doing something useful.

So, you have that choice: slowly yank twenty million gil out of FFXI's economy (I once spent three months mining for one goddamned pair of gloves. Oh was that fun or what!), or go buy the gil. Almost everyone picks the latter, you can hardly blame them: IGE has FFXI's userbase by the short hairs, and the game is doomed for it.

All of this could have been avoided if someone had left that truckload of **** retentiveness out when they were programming the game. But hey, if centuries spent killing the same mob over and over hoping for that extra-rare drop is what trips it for you...well, that's, ah...that's sad.

Ever wonder how the survivors in the life boats felt as they watched Titanic go down? I'm kind of wondering why so many people are still on the boat, to be honest with you.

Good post.

No. Unlike you I'm an honest player. Which explains my ignorance as to how windower works.

I'm done with this thread. Seems like the ones responding to my posts aren't understanding my point. If that is my fault, then I apologize for my lack of articulation. May you find something more fulfilling in your lives other than a video game.