I have been studying the buying patterns of the players on FFXI for quite some time. I notice how may people by from the Auction house according to the Price History. Ive also found that the balance between highlever players and lower lever plays amazing because of the 2 year gap in playtime. WE NEED TO BECOME A VOICE IN OUR ECONOMY! I MAKE 1000sgil by the hour. I farm easy stuff for drops, (perferably guild items) I find out their going price, then slice them 75% to 50% depending on how fast it was for me to go and get the items. Guilders love it because its less money they have to spend = more money they make off the items they craft. I tried to guild before but noticed that the break even point on manythings kidnof sucked if you bought all you stuff at the AH. HERE IS A SAMPLE CHART:
Determine the time it took you to get the items farmed
How many did you retrieve
What is the going price for these items
UNDER CUT UNDERCUT (ITEMS MOVE FAST MONEY MOVES IN)
You might not believe me, but i made 10k in 3hours. This was all on easy stuff!! I made 28k but i have to wait for my other things to sell at the AUCTION HOUSE.. (NOT FAST AT ALL)
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How to make alot of Gil pt 1Follow
And thus.. The destruction of the economy begins :)
You're just ruining the economy this way! Why can't you just set your prices at normal and wait like everyone else?!
The Japanese have a different economy than we do, it's pretty amazing. At night the whole economy shifts with different standard prices for everything, some things cheaper, some things more expensive. Then during the day things shift back.
BTW, you can do better than $10k in 3 hours, and just use mules ($1 a month!) to sell slow items. It's more profitable, and you don't blow the econ by creating a bid war.
BTW, you can do better than $10k in 3 hours, and just use mules ($1 a month!) to sell slow items. It's more profitable, and you don't blow the econ by creating a bid war.
chances are you can sell the eq you bought at the AH for the same you paid ... no need for undercutting
Undercutting once-in-a-while is OK I suppose, if you need the cash RIGHT THEN to maybe upgrade weapons/armor/spells.
Constant undercutting is idiotic, especially in massive amounts. Stacks of whatever selling for 10k? Fine you undercut one stack for 7k no one will notice and no one will adjust prices, they'll just figure you needed the cash asap. Put up 5 stacks for 7k? Now there is a trend and now ALL stacks sell for 7k, NOW for you to sell before everyone you have to undercut even FARTHER. And so on...
Not that hard to figure out, see where this is going...
Z
Constant undercutting is idiotic, especially in massive amounts. Stacks of whatever selling for 10k? Fine you undercut one stack for 7k no one will notice and no one will adjust prices, they'll just figure you needed the cash asap. Put up 5 stacks for 7k? Now there is a trend and now ALL stacks sell for 7k, NOW for you to sell before everyone you have to undercut even FARTHER. And so on...
Not that hard to figure out, see where this is going...
Z
I agree comepletely.
The economy is crazy how different it is for guild items between NA prime time, and JPN prime time.
1000 gil for a stack of flint stone, is nothing for a JPN. It is slow to farm, and they have better things to do, to make money. The supply gets short over night, and prices get high.
NA's log on, see the high prices, farm/sell flint stones and drop the price back down to 6-700 gil, in no time.
There are longer term trends such as NA's guilding bellow lvl 20, then gradually as a whole, most crafters move to the above 20 skill and so on. Items they NEED to train skill get expensive, and items the end in nothing more to be made from a blown out cheap.
Example, brass ingots are needed for many things, make them into sheets, and then into scales, you can get a lot of skill, but then the scale sell for nothing compared to what you need to put into ingots.
The economy is awsome, and even with the people who undercut, they can't truely effect the market for a long period of time.
The economy is crazy how different it is for guild items between NA prime time, and JPN prime time.
1000 gil for a stack of flint stone, is nothing for a JPN. It is slow to farm, and they have better things to do, to make money. The supply gets short over night, and prices get high.
NA's log on, see the high prices, farm/sell flint stones and drop the price back down to 6-700 gil, in no time.
There are longer term trends such as NA's guilding bellow lvl 20, then gradually as a whole, most crafters move to the above 20 skill and so on. Items they NEED to train skill get expensive, and items the end in nothing more to be made from a blown out cheap.
Example, brass ingots are needed for many things, make them into sheets, and then into scales, you can get a lot of skill, but then the scale sell for nothing compared to what you need to put into ingots.
The economy is awsome, and even with the people who undercut, they can't truely effect the market for a long period of time.
It's crazy how big of a swing sometimes you can see overnight just moving through NA peak time and JP peak time. If people were just more patient when they put items up for sale, the high level JP crafters will buy their items at the high rate eventually. It might be overnight, but waiting that extra day makes a big difference.
Samus taught us that a girl doesn't need brains to be successful. Brains are giant, evil and vulnerable to missiles.
43 posts
I do basiclly the exact same thing as Heena. But, as I've noticed, the prices tend to start decreasing as more people start to put items up for less. When I get enough gil, and am will to, I think I'll just start going and buying things at higher prices than they're set for. Try and get the prices high again so I can make more off the items I bought. I'm still in the process of figuring out the holes and fixing them, but I hope to really raise the prices.
(sorry about my spelling errors, if there are any. I can't spell, I've always been bad at it)
(sorry about my spelling errors, if there are any. I can't spell, I've always been bad at it)
Uh. Dude. Seriously your undercut thing will **** up the AH. Even you, yourself will start getting less money cuz the price is falling. Thats a dumb idea. Just use mules works much better you get more money per item. And you don't f*** up the AH. Good luck on continueing your "study of buying paterns". 10k in 3 hours is nothing. I can't wait to diss part 2!!!
i guess this is why every day prices drop in ah. when i first started playing, a stack of fire crystals was 2200 gil. now they are selling for 1400..
no wonder why its harder to obtain gil nowadays.
no wonder why its harder to obtain gil nowadays.
43 posts
Same thing happened to me. Because if the drop in the prices of crystals, I have stopped selling items for less, but instead buy them for more. I'm just want to get the prices high again so I ca make more money at the AH.
Quote:
i guess this is why every day prices drop in ah. when i first started playing, a stack of fire crystals was 2200 gil. now they are selling for 1400..
no wonder why its harder to obtain gil nowadays.
no wonder why its harder to obtain gil nowadays.
Depends on the time of day, and the day of the week. Fire crystals will creep back up to 2K on a regular basis, and it's not uncommon to see wind crystals around 1.5k. Earth and Water crystals, on the other hand, are doomed to suck for the rest of eternity.
This is just awful, awful advice. Undercut 75% to 50%? Why? Two days ago I farmed a few stacks of bat wings. Going price at AH was 2500, and I put them there at 2500. Logged on the next day, both stacks were sold. If I'd taken your advice I would have lost between 1250 and 2500 gil. And I would have had a negative impact by being a deflationary force on the market that could have taken days to recorrect.
I sold for 15 000 gil of items between monday night and tuesday night. The worst undercut I did was less than 5%, and that's usually for low volume items only.
I sold for 15 000 gil of items between monday night and tuesday night. The worst undercut I did was less than 5%, and that's usually for low volume items only.
To also add, 10k in 3 hours is really slow.
If you spend 3 hours farming, you should be able to average almost 10k per hour, and that is on low level, can be killed with one boomerang hit, mobs.
If that means bringing the bare minimum equipment so you can efficiently kill the mobs you are farming, so be it. Why do you need your rings and earrings, when you are going to kill in 1 hit. Why do you need all your armour, when maximum hit if you are naked is going to be less than 5/6. This leaves lots of slots for stuff.
I hope you get a clue for your future installments (or don't bother).
If you spend 3 hours farming, you should be able to average almost 10k per hour, and that is on low level, can be killed with one boomerang hit, mobs.
If that means bringing the bare minimum equipment so you can efficiently kill the mobs you are farming, so be it. Why do you need your rings and earrings, when you are going to kill in 1 hit. Why do you need all your armour, when maximum hit if you are naked is going to be less than 5/6. This leaves lots of slots for stuff.
I hope you get a clue for your future installments (or don't bother).
20 posts
Hey theres no need to cut you prices 50 to 75% in order to sell the items faster. You simply set the price 5 gil lower than regular aution price , place it up for bid and if everyone else sets there price at regular price then your item will be the first sold , it will also sell at the standard price . I tryed this a while back with fire crystal stacks and manage to sell them right away even though there are 70 or so stacks in front of mine. Just give it a try before you go ruining the entire game economy.
Greedy NA players like this guy is why PC on pandemonium server has crashed......hard
prices on most armor levels 1-40 has dropped by 60% in the last month.watching the AH you see how people undercutting each other by 100-200gil has slowly eroded the price.
You will get your quick cash now but eventually making gil will be a real pain in the *** because you wont be able to sell anything for much.
worst degrade has been the mithkabob market and yagado drinks
stacks of mithkabobs are now 2k and individually they sell for around 200gil.
Yag drinks are now selling for 600-800gil
yeah undercut....it makes you get gil faster....dumbasses
prices on most armor levels 1-40 has dropped by 60% in the last month.watching the AH you see how people undercutting each other by 100-200gil has slowly eroded the price.
You will get your quick cash now but eventually making gil will be a real pain in the *** because you wont be able to sell anything for much.
worst degrade has been the mithkabob market and yagado drinks
stacks of mithkabobs are now 2k and individually they sell for around 200gil.
Yag drinks are now selling for 600-800gil
yeah undercut....it makes you get gil faster....dumbasses
One point I don't see mentioned:
This is not an economy where money is constantly being taken out of circulation, and where the amount of money created is being set by the government to control inflation or deflation. The only time gil completely goes out of circulation is if your character (and his or her gil) is deleted.
Selling things for a lower price, in the long run, will make... everything sell for less.
At this point, there will be too much gil in peoples hands, and the amounts they will be willing to pay will rise, and therefore... everything will sell for more.
Another thing:
Ask someone in EQ how much they paid for banded armor back at the time of release, up until about 2 years later. And then see what it sells for now. Naturally, as new items are added, lower level costs will decrease. If the price of lower level items decrease, the price that lower level characters sell items for will naturally decrease, as their desire for X amount of gil won't be nearly as high.
I think in the end, none of it matters. This is a game economy. The market isn't going to crash, unless there is a huge dupe like the one that hit EQ a few months back. And even then, it will recover. Sell it for what you want for it, and that will be that.
Tradeskills will always be a risk of ingame finances, for a great many reasons. None of which I'll take the time to type, most are pretty obvious if you start to think about it.
Oh well, something to think about, at least.
This is not an economy where money is constantly being taken out of circulation, and where the amount of money created is being set by the government to control inflation or deflation. The only time gil completely goes out of circulation is if your character (and his or her gil) is deleted.
Selling things for a lower price, in the long run, will make... everything sell for less.
At this point, there will be too much gil in peoples hands, and the amounts they will be willing to pay will rise, and therefore... everything will sell for more.
Another thing:
Ask someone in EQ how much they paid for banded armor back at the time of release, up until about 2 years later. And then see what it sells for now. Naturally, as new items are added, lower level costs will decrease. If the price of lower level items decrease, the price that lower level characters sell items for will naturally decrease, as their desire for X amount of gil won't be nearly as high.
I think in the end, none of it matters. This is a game economy. The market isn't going to crash, unless there is a huge dupe like the one that hit EQ a few months back. And even then, it will recover. Sell it for what you want for it, and that will be that.
Tradeskills will always be a risk of ingame finances, for a great many reasons. None of which I'll take the time to type, most are pretty obvious if you start to think about it.
Oh well, something to think about, at least.
if too many people are farming and selling the same item, the price should go down. why? because more items are being sold than are being consumed. so if i come to the ah and see that there are a lot of something for sale then im going to set my price 10-20%lower than last sale. the other choice is to get that item back 3 days later having wasted my ah slot for all that time.
but dont worry, the economy will not collapse. for all the people that are farming this item, it will become less profitable. now comes the important part:
you can do 2 things about it
1. realize that there are too many people doing what you are doing to make gil. prices are deflating as they should. look at the ah, see what sells fast and has few items for sale. now start selling this item instead. adapt to gain an advantage.
OR
2. you can post here about how what you were doing before isnt working and how its not fair and continue to do what you were doing for less and less profit. remain static like an idiot and lose out.
there are lots of ways to make gil. if you only do what everyone else is doing then you wont get very far. be creative. there are lots of things you can exploit.
in summary: be dynamic, analyze the economy, identify a need, satisfy that need, make lots of gil.
dont be a whiny noob
but dont worry, the economy will not collapse. for all the people that are farming this item, it will become less profitable. now comes the important part:
you can do 2 things about it
1. realize that there are too many people doing what you are doing to make gil. prices are deflating as they should. look at the ah, see what sells fast and has few items for sale. now start selling this item instead. adapt to gain an advantage.
OR
2. you can post here about how what you were doing before isnt working and how its not fair and continue to do what you were doing for less and less profit. remain static like an idiot and lose out.
there are lots of ways to make gil. if you only do what everyone else is doing then you wont get very far. be creative. there are lots of things you can exploit.
in summary: be dynamic, analyze the economy, identify a need, satisfy that need, make lots of gil.
dont be a whiny noob
Scholar
25 posts
For a while i didn't know how the order was for sales at the AH. Well after i figured it out I sellmy items pretty fast. You see that the AH has say 20 of an item at 4k. Well if you put you item up for 4k it takes a while to sell it. But if you set it for say 3901 gil then your will sell before anyone else who has their's set at anything over your price. Most people when bidding on items that cost a good amount of gil won't try to find out the price, but will just go straight to 4k if they can't get it at 3.9k. sorry if someone already posted this. try doing this and see how it works for you. I myself would rather wait and get some more gil then to cut prices that much. If you cut them that much now...what will happen when you go to sell that item again? Will you cut it even more? If you do then you will lose out because it won't be worth it to farm that item anymore.
generally if i havne't sold some fast-moving item in 12 hrs, ill re-check the price history. sometimes people came in at under 100g or so and theirs sold first. ill adjust accordingly or wait it out if i know how much demand there is for this item.
usu dont need to go down that much..and in no hurry to make some money. since it'll sell eventually.
10k in 3hrs yes...but if you hadn't undersold, you might have 15k.
I always set my values at fair market value, I don't try to cheat the system or undercut. One night I had 7 items up (not cheap crap, all were 4 digits, most above 3k, and some crafting stuff) Next day I log on, and it was all sold, 27K for me. Selling while you sleep is great, don't expect armor to sell fast, I wouldn't go farming this kind of stuff unless it was very high demand. Usually anything under 1000 I send to my mules, anything over I put on my mains block. I can make 5k an hour pretty easy farming as a sub 20 thief, and get exp while doing it, the reason I like thief is steal and TH really must help, because otherwise I can't understand why people can lack so much money without them.
Don't mass kill low level stuff, you get minimal drops and disrupt exp hunters. Level up another job, if they start to get to high (around level 15), have some fun, suicide to get back to town (talk about a time saver), explore some dangerous areas, take a snapshot of that ghost, as long as you are farming only for gil, and not exp, there is no loss.
Earth and Water crystals -> Gardening
Don't mass kill low level stuff, you get minimal drops and disrupt exp hunters. Level up another job, if they start to get to high (around level 15), have some fun, suicide to get back to town (talk about a time saver), explore some dangerous areas, take a snapshot of that ghost, as long as you are farming only for gil, and not exp, there is no loss.
Earth and Water crystals -> Gardening
Okay, whenever an mmorpg starts off, prices are usually high, because there is little knowledge of where or how to make that item, and there is only a limited amount of those items on the market. As the game progresses, there will be more knowledge of how to make armor or weapons, etc or where to find certain items, being passed around, and this will cause more people to supply the demand and prices will fall. Just look at the real life economy, lets say.. plasma TV's, when they first came out, the prices were nuts, nowadays the prices have really gone down.
Undercutting is competition, just dont overdo it, because eventually its going to hit you when your getting little or NO money for the effort you put into it.
Undercutting is competition, just dont overdo it, because eventually its going to hit you when your getting little or NO money for the effort you put into it.
undercutting made me set cent. armor to 9k instead of 11-12k. I lost 3 on each piece beh.
You guys are ignoring the other side of this equation. Things are cheaper!! You might be making less money but things are cheaper now. It's just a side effect of when more consumers enters the market, eventually price will stablize. For now it's the buyer's market.
3 points:
1> Gil does leave the economy when people buy from NPCs. I know people sell to them too, but I doubt there is a 1 to 1 ratio. Admittedly, I would consider this negligable in the big picture, but I wanted to point it out.
2> The idea of 'as more people learn to craft prices for crafting will drop' I feel is flawed. The way I see it is 'As a greater percentage of players have a high level crafting skill, the prices will drop'. This doesn't scare me. I think the PS2 influx will actually alter the prices of crafted items to some degree. This is not because of the nature of console gamers, but because of the NA mindset of 'power gaming'. The Japanese culture (from what I know of it) is less geared towards instant gratification than the American culture. Therefore, a greater percentage of them take to fishing and crafting as it is more fulfilling to their cultural bias. (not meant as good or bad, just my observation) I think the tilt we have in the ratio of crafters/fishers versus power levellers will alter the prices for crafted items further in the AH due to the desire of younger NA gamers to buy something rather than spend hours and hours learning to make it to sell. I may be wrong though.
3> If you don't want someone to undercut you constantly for a quick profit, then stop farming the same stuff everyone else does. On the rare occasion that I feel like farming I'm more than happy to get crystals, thread, etc. However, my real goal is to get a product that is easily obtainable in the local area, but is almost nonexistant in the area I am headed to next but is in moderate to high demand. For instance, grass/thread/cotton is easy to come by in bastok even though the mobs are farmed in Windurst. For some odd reason there are a few amazingly simple items to get in Windy that I can farm even as a lvl 20 WHM that are not close to that available in Bastok. They don't have quite as high of a demand or cost but I can grab crawlers, etc on my way to farm and grab a few stacks of these items. Then I head to bastok and sell them. After that I fill up on some items that are needed for crafting in Windy but unavailable there in great quantity and head back to Windy. By the time I get there, my moderate to high demand vs. Low supply have already sold generally, and I can grab cash in my rent-a-room, grab the stacks of Bastok items from it and go drop them on the Windy Market ^^
I'm sure I'm not the best at getting gil, but as a WHM there's not a whole lot that I can farm as easily without switching to another class and raising that up to farm, and honestly I dun wanna use my sub as main... I hated it when I was levelling it, and I still do.
1> Gil does leave the economy when people buy from NPCs. I know people sell to them too, but I doubt there is a 1 to 1 ratio. Admittedly, I would consider this negligable in the big picture, but I wanted to point it out.
2> The idea of 'as more people learn to craft prices for crafting will drop' I feel is flawed. The way I see it is 'As a greater percentage of players have a high level crafting skill, the prices will drop'. This doesn't scare me. I think the PS2 influx will actually alter the prices of crafted items to some degree. This is not because of the nature of console gamers, but because of the NA mindset of 'power gaming'. The Japanese culture (from what I know of it) is less geared towards instant gratification than the American culture. Therefore, a greater percentage of them take to fishing and crafting as it is more fulfilling to their cultural bias. (not meant as good or bad, just my observation) I think the tilt we have in the ratio of crafters/fishers versus power levellers will alter the prices for crafted items further in the AH due to the desire of younger NA gamers to buy something rather than spend hours and hours learning to make it to sell. I may be wrong though.
3> If you don't want someone to undercut you constantly for a quick profit, then stop farming the same stuff everyone else does. On the rare occasion that I feel like farming I'm more than happy to get crystals, thread, etc. However, my real goal is to get a product that is easily obtainable in the local area, but is almost nonexistant in the area I am headed to next but is in moderate to high demand. For instance, grass/thread/cotton is easy to come by in bastok even though the mobs are farmed in Windurst. For some odd reason there are a few amazingly simple items to get in Windy that I can farm even as a lvl 20 WHM that are not close to that available in Bastok. They don't have quite as high of a demand or cost but I can grab crawlers, etc on my way to farm and grab a few stacks of these items. Then I head to bastok and sell them. After that I fill up on some items that are needed for crafting in Windy but unavailable there in great quantity and head back to Windy. By the time I get there, my moderate to high demand vs. Low supply have already sold generally, and I can grab cash in my rent-a-room, grab the stacks of Bastok items from it and go drop them on the Windy Market ^^
I'm sure I'm not the best at getting gil, but as a WHM there's not a whole lot that I can farm as easily without switching to another class and raising that up to farm, and honestly I dun wanna use my sub as main... I hated it when I was levelling it, and I still do.
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